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	<title>Comments on: &#8220;Old School&#8221; Direct Marketing on the Internet</title>
	<link>http://bly.com/blog/online-marketing/old-school-direct-marketing-on-the-internet/</link>
	<description>bly.com direct marketing blog</description>
	<pubDate>Wed, 03 Dec 2008 19:33:21 +0000</pubDate>
	<generator>http://wordpress.org/?v=2.3.1</generator>
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		<title>By: LShep</title>
		<link>http://bly.com/blog/online-marketing/old-school-direct-marketing-on-the-internet/#comment-674380</link>
		<dc:creator>LShep</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 06 Aug 2008 02:17:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://bly.com/blog/online-marketing/old-school-direct-marketing-on-the-internet/#comment-674380</guid>
		<description>Actually, the problem is more with the clients than the copywriters. Most SEO copywriters breathe a sigh of relief when they get that rare client who doesn't just want a piece of copy full of their key phrase. 

Unfortunately, that's what the majority of them are looking for right now. They give you a phrase or two, though I've had as many as 40 for one article, and the keyword density and that's all they're interested in. I do have clients who care about more than that, and those are the ones worth sticking in the game for. I have some that want both keywords and substance and even a few that don't care about keywords. But, those are extremely hard to find online.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Actually, the problem is more with the clients than the copywriters. Most SEO copywriters breathe a sigh of relief when they get that rare client who doesn&#8217;t just want a piece of copy full of their key phrase. </p>
<p>Unfortunately, that&#8217;s what the majority of them are looking for right now. They give you a phrase or two, though I&#8217;ve had as many as 40 for one article, and the keyword density and that&#8217;s all they&#8217;re interested in. I do have clients who care about more than that, and those are the ones worth sticking in the game for. I have some that want both keywords and substance and even a few that don&#8217;t care about keywords. But, those are extremely hard to find online.</p>
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		<title>By: Bob Bly</title>
		<link>http://bly.com/blog/online-marketing/old-school-direct-marketing-on-the-internet/#comment-674375</link>
		<dc:creator>Bob Bly</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 05 Aug 2008 18:47:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://bly.com/blog/online-marketing/old-school-direct-marketing-on-the-internet/#comment-674375</guid>
		<description>Joe: I disagree that giving away product as a marketing strategy is ineffective. Go to the food court in the mall. The most crowded food vendor is usually the one with an employee standing in the aisle, holding a tray of free samples of their chicken nuggets. People eat the free sample and then stop to buy a box or two. Barnes &#038; Noble finds the longer people stay in the store reading books for free, the more books they buy when they leave.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Joe: I disagree that giving away product as a marketing strategy is ineffective. Go to the food court in the mall. The most crowded food vendor is usually the one with an employee standing in the aisle, holding a tray of free samples of their chicken nuggets. People eat the free sample and then stop to buy a box or two. Barnes &#038; Noble finds the longer people stay in the store reading books for free, the more books they buy when they leave.</p>
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		<title>By: joe sixpak</title>
		<link>http://bly.com/blog/online-marketing/old-school-direct-marketing-on-the-internet/#comment-674374</link>
		<dc:creator>joe sixpak</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 05 Aug 2008 17:15:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://bly.com/blog/online-marketing/old-school-direct-marketing-on-the-internet/#comment-674374</guid>
		<description>real marketing is like manufacturing
it helps to create wealth by producing things and selling them 

the internet approach of giving it all away and then somehow sometime making some money later on is like flipping burgers after shipping the manufacturing jobs somewhere else 

you can make a little money for a while with the free internet  model, but when all the folks whose manufacturing jobs got shipped to india are broke then the burger flippers wont be needed either 

love of money is the root of all evil but there is nothing evil about producing and selling products that help society.  how people are treated and how the money is made can be evil but total rebellion against making money at all is silly.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>real marketing is like manufacturing<br />
it helps to create wealth by producing things and selling them </p>
<p>the internet approach of giving it all away and then somehow sometime making some money later on is like flipping burgers after shipping the manufacturing jobs somewhere else </p>
<p>you can make a little money for a while with the free internet  model, but when all the folks whose manufacturing jobs got shipped to india are broke then the burger flippers wont be needed either </p>
<p>love of money is the root of all evil but there is nothing evil about producing and selling products that help society.  how people are treated and how the money is made can be evil but total rebellion against making money at all is silly.</p>
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		<title>By: Heather Lloyd-Martin</title>
		<link>http://bly.com/blog/online-marketing/old-school-direct-marketing-on-the-internet/#comment-674364</link>
		<dc:creator>Heather Lloyd-Martin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 04 Aug 2008 18:47:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://bly.com/blog/online-marketing/old-school-direct-marketing-on-the-internet/#comment-674364</guid>
		<description>Hi, Bob-

Thanks for touching upon a HUGE pet peeve of mine!

I don't know how many "SEO copywriters" I've talked with who believe that it's all about shoving keyphrases into copy. They don't know how to write a compelling headline. They don't think in terms of "benefit statements." Heck, many folks don't even know what direct response writing *is.* Instead, these writers are repeating the same words over and over to gain (or game) keyphrase relevancy.

What's worse is that clients are paying top dollar for this content thinking that SEO copywriting is supposed to sound like a laundry list of keyphrases.

It drives me nuts.

Thanks for your email earlier today and letting me post my own rant...

http://www.seocopywriting.com/commentary/why-direct-reponse-writing-skills-are-so-damn-important/

Cheers!
Heather</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi, Bob-</p>
<p>Thanks for touching upon a HUGE pet peeve of mine!</p>
<p>I don&#8217;t know how many &#8220;SEO copywriters&#8221; I&#8217;ve talked with who believe that it&#8217;s all about shoving keyphrases into copy. They don&#8217;t know how to write a compelling headline. They don&#8217;t think in terms of &#8220;benefit statements.&#8221; Heck, many folks don&#8217;t even know what direct response writing *is.* Instead, these writers are repeating the same words over and over to gain (or game) keyphrase relevancy.</p>
<p>What&#8217;s worse is that clients are paying top dollar for this content thinking that SEO copywriting is supposed to sound like a laundry list of keyphrases.</p>
<p>It drives me nuts.</p>
<p>Thanks for your email earlier today and letting me post my own rant&#8230;</p>
<p><a href="http://www.seocopywriting.com/commentary/why-direct-reponse-writing-skills-are-so-damn-important/" rel="nofollow">http://www.seocopywriting.com/commentary/why-direct-reponse-writing-skills-are-so-damn-important/</a></p>
<p>Cheers!<br />
Heather</p>
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		<title>By: Aida Profit Formula. &#124; 7Wins.eu</title>
		<link>http://bly.com/blog/online-marketing/old-school-direct-marketing-on-the-internet/#comment-674360</link>
		<dc:creator>Aida Profit Formula. &#124; 7Wins.eu</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 04 Aug 2008 17:13:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://bly.com/blog/online-marketing/old-school-direct-marketing-on-the-internet/#comment-674360</guid>
		<description>[...] FIRST NAME:  EMAIL:  No spam. Your information is safe with us.      Sites you may be interested in  &#8220;Old School&#8221; Direct Marketing on the Internet - bly.com blog - bly.com direct marketing...cruisin2cashwithtom.com ? Blog Archive ? Advertising 101 For Entrepreneurs How To Improve Your [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[&#8230;] FIRST NAME:  EMAIL:  No spam. Your information is safe with us.      Sites you may be interested in  &#8220;Old School&#8221; Direct Marketing on the Internet - bly.com blog - bly.com direct marketing&#8230;cruisin2cashwithtom.com ? Blog Archive ? Advertising 101 For Entrepreneurs How To Improve Your [&#8230;]</p>
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		<title>By: Bob Bly</title>
		<link>http://bly.com/blog/online-marketing/old-school-direct-marketing-on-the-internet/#comment-674351</link>
		<dc:creator>Bob Bly</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 03 Aug 2008 21:35:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://bly.com/blog/online-marketing/old-school-direct-marketing-on-the-internet/#comment-674351</guid>
		<description>Mark Allen: With all due respect to you and David Scott -- are you kidding? Look at the companies making huge profits direct response: Day Timer, Omaha Steaks, Franklin Covey, Boardroom, Agora Publishing, Weiss Research, Lombardi, Franklin Mint. Now, a thought experiment: cut out all their online and print direct response campaigns. Replace with your social media strategies. Do you seriously think you could match their current level of revenues? Come on!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Mark Allen: With all due respect to you and David Scott &#8212; are you kidding? Look at the companies making huge profits direct response: Day Timer, Omaha Steaks, Franklin Covey, Boardroom, Agora Publishing, Weiss Research, Lombardi, Franklin Mint. Now, a thought experiment: cut out all their online and print direct response campaigns. Replace with your social media strategies. Do you seriously think you could match their current level of revenues? Come on!</p>
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		<title>By: nikeshoesvip</title>
		<link>http://bly.com/blog/online-marketing/old-school-direct-marketing-on-the-internet/#comment-674343</link>
		<dc:creator>nikeshoesvip</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 02 Aug 2008 02:24:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://bly.com/blog/online-marketing/old-school-direct-marketing-on-the-internet/#comment-674343</guid>
		<description>www.nikeshoesvip.com Factory wholesale Cheap nikes,nike jordans,Jordan Shoes-wholesale Cheap Nike Air Jordan's Shoes;We sell cheap Nike Jordan's Shoes with discount, also Carry many New Jordan Shoes, most are Jordsan womens Shoes, some are jordan womens Shoes For Michael Jordan's Shoes and Nike Jordan Basketball shoes. We Wholesale Jordan Shoes with much discount and best price of Nike Air Jordan Shoes and Jordan Tennis Shoes at our Jordan shoes website. From us you can get more information like air jordan shoes release date, rare Jordan Shoes.
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our Email:  vipnikeshoe@yahoo.com.cn</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><a href="http://www.nikeshoesvip.com" rel="nofollow">www.nikeshoesvip.com</a> Factory wholesale Cheap nikes,nike jordans,Jordan Shoes-wholesale Cheap Nike Air Jordan&#8217;s Shoes;We sell cheap Nike Jordan&#8217;s Shoes with discount, also Carry many New Jordan Shoes, most are Jordsan womens Shoes, some are jordan womens Shoes For Michael Jordan&#8217;s Shoes and Nike Jordan Basketball shoes. We Wholesale Jordan Shoes with much discount and best price of Nike Air Jordan Shoes and Jordan Tennis Shoes at our Jordan shoes website. From us you can get more information like air jordan shoes release date, rare Jordan Shoes.<br />
our site: <a href="http://www.nikeshoesvip.com" rel="nofollow">http://www.nikeshoesvip.com</a><br />
our MSN:  <a href="mailto:nikeshoesvip@hotmail.com">nikeshoesvip@hotmail.com</a><br />
our Email:  <a href="mailto:vipnikeshoe@yahoo.com.cn">vipnikeshoe@yahoo.com.cn</a></p>
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		<title>By: Grant A. Johnson</title>
		<link>http://bly.com/blog/online-marketing/old-school-direct-marketing-on-the-internet/#comment-674327</link>
		<dc:creator>Grant A. Johnson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 31 Jul 2008 03:01:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://bly.com/blog/online-marketing/old-school-direct-marketing-on-the-internet/#comment-674327</guid>
		<description>Bad copy is bad copy; great copy is great copy. What's the secret? Relevance. Regardless of old or new media, if the copy, offer and messaging resonate with the intended segment(s), success will be yours.

What's the key to relevancy? Usually it's the offers/messaging you make/use.

My experience in not either/or, it's using the right channel with the right message and usually involves adjusting such to each segment based on THEIR channel preference, not mine as a marketer.

Both old and new need to apply correct testing -- sadly that's still done infrequently.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Bad copy is bad copy; great copy is great copy. What&#8217;s the secret? Relevance. Regardless of old or new media, if the copy, offer and messaging resonate with the intended segment(s), success will be yours.</p>
<p>What&#8217;s the key to relevancy? Usually it&#8217;s the offers/messaging you make/use.</p>
<p>My experience in not either/or, it&#8217;s using the right channel with the right message and usually involves adjusting such to each segment based on THEIR channel preference, not mine as a marketer.</p>
<p>Both old and new need to apply correct testing &#8212; sadly that&#8217;s still done infrequently.</p>
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		<title>By: mark allen roberts</title>
		<link>http://bly.com/blog/online-marketing/old-school-direct-marketing-on-the-internet/#comment-674311</link>
		<dc:creator>mark allen roberts</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 28 Jul 2008 23:44:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://bly.com/blog/online-marketing/old-school-direct-marketing-on-the-internet/#comment-674311</guid>
		<description>I must say , my original comment about traditional direct mail , having sold it to clients like MSN.Com and others in the past, and used it in the companies I served, would have been “there will always be a place for it in an integrated marketing. “

 I have experienced the impact a well executed direct campaign can have for customers….but that was eight years ago.

I do not want to be argumentative or emotional. I had a mentor teach me a long time ago when faced with emotion, work with facts. 

The proponents of direct marketing make their living selling it, and I hope they have better statistics than what I found as I really want to learn more. 

We used to sell clients “our creative and data base tools create an interruption for the right buyer at the right time” and we had case studies to prove it. (just the ones that worked)

Today I would like to ask company doing direct marketing a single question;

 “how’s that working for you?” 

I don’t mean the creative, or the customer service you receive from your direct mail partners, or the number of leads, but what impact is your investment in direct marketing having on your bottom line? Do you know? 

I was having a conversation about traditional verse new rules of marketing with the guy who wrote the New Rules of Marketing and PR book, David Meerman Scott and he very quickly helped me understand the new rules and their implications with some very quick questions;

“When was the last time I received a piece of direct mail in the last 90 days that identified a perfect solution to a problem I have, and I acted on it?”

“When was the last time, in the last year I went to a trade show searching for a solution to a problem I have?”

“Have I seen a print ad in the last month that was a perfect solution for a problem and I acted on it?”

Then he asked me the following;

“Have I used a search engine in the last week to find a solution to a problem I have?” …and he sold me.

I think every CEO needs to be asked these questions from their investors. What I found was I did not know what I did not know. 

It bothered me so much I did some surface research. I found an ROI report and benchmark Guide by NCM very informative. They studied brands in 2005 through 2007 and here is what I gathered from their report;

•	For every $1 dollar spent in direct mail we should experience a return of approximately $11.49

•	For every dollar spent on other forms of traditional marketing we should expect to see a return of $2.24 to $1.93

•	For every $1 spent in social media we should expect to realize $63.07 return, and if I continue over a number of years as some of the brands studied I will see a return of $112.

•	94.94 % of consumers surveyed are very satisfied or satisfied with social media

•	97% of consumers said there is a good chance or better they will refer a great social site to a friend or family member.

So how’s that working for you? 

Are you receiving a strong return on your investment? Keep up the good work! However if you are like the small and large business owners asking us what should they do different in such difficult economic times I have to recommend social media as an important tool.Measure your results, and adapt.

 
Mark Allen Roberts http://www.tunedinblog.com/blog/pragmatic-marketing.html</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I must say , my original comment about traditional direct mail , having sold it to clients like MSN.Com and others in the past, and used it in the companies I served, would have been “there will always be a place for it in an integrated marketing. “</p>
<p> I have experienced the impact a well executed direct campaign can have for customers….but that was eight years ago.</p>
<p>I do not want to be argumentative or emotional. I had a mentor teach me a long time ago when faced with emotion, work with facts. </p>
<p>The proponents of direct marketing make their living selling it, and I hope they have better statistics than what I found as I really want to learn more. </p>
<p>We used to sell clients “our creative and data base tools create an interruption for the right buyer at the right time” and we had case studies to prove it. (just the ones that worked)</p>
<p>Today I would like to ask company doing direct marketing a single question;</p>
<p> “how’s that working for you?” </p>
<p>I don’t mean the creative, or the customer service you receive from your direct mail partners, or the number of leads, but what impact is your investment in direct marketing having on your bottom line? Do you know? </p>
<p>I was having a conversation about traditional verse new rules of marketing with the guy who wrote the New Rules of Marketing and PR book, David Meerman Scott and he very quickly helped me understand the new rules and their implications with some very quick questions;</p>
<p>“When was the last time I received a piece of direct mail in the last 90 days that identified a perfect solution to a problem I have, and I acted on it?”</p>
<p>“When was the last time, in the last year I went to a trade show searching for a solution to a problem I have?”</p>
<p>“Have I seen a print ad in the last month that was a perfect solution for a problem and I acted on it?”</p>
<p>Then he asked me the following;</p>
<p>“Have I used a search engine in the last week to find a solution to a problem I have?” …and he sold me.</p>
<p>I think every CEO needs to be asked these questions from their investors. What I found was I did not know what I did not know. </p>
<p>It bothered me so much I did some surface research. I found an ROI report and benchmark Guide by NCM very informative. They studied brands in 2005 through 2007 and here is what I gathered from their report;</p>
<p>•	For every $1 dollar spent in direct mail we should experience a return of approximately $11.49</p>
<p>•	For every dollar spent on other forms of traditional marketing we should expect to see a return of $2.24 to $1.93</p>
<p>•	For every $1 spent in social media we should expect to realize $63.07 return, and if I continue over a number of years as some of the brands studied I will see a return of $112.</p>
<p>•	94.94 % of consumers surveyed are very satisfied or satisfied with social media</p>
<p>•	97% of consumers said there is a good chance or better they will refer a great social site to a friend or family member.</p>
<p>So how’s that working for you? </p>
<p>Are you receiving a strong return on your investment? Keep up the good work! However if you are like the small and large business owners asking us what should they do different in such difficult economic times I have to recommend social media as an important tool.Measure your results, and adapt.</p>
<p>Mark Allen Roberts <a href="http://www.tunedinblog.com/blog/pragmatic-marketing.html" rel="nofollow">http://www.tunedinblog.com/blog/pragmatic-marketing.html</a></p>
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		<title>By: Ted Grigg</title>
		<link>http://bly.com/blog/online-marketing/old-school-direct-marketing-on-the-internet/#comment-674306</link>
		<dc:creator>Ted Grigg</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 28 Jul 2008 19:12:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://bly.com/blog/online-marketing/old-school-direct-marketing-on-the-internet/#comment-674306</guid>
		<description>Apryl Parcher hit upon the response to your original question when by saying:


"I don?t believe that 'old school Direct Response' has lost touch with the new world?it?s the other way around."

What impact will our ideas about how to leverage social media, twitter or even spam weary email environments do when the people who cut their teeth on new media don't even have a command of the basics?

We?ve seen terms like Web2, Web 3 and will probably read about Web 285 soon. Then we also hear terms like ?squeeze pages? that traditional marketers know how to do better than inexperienced marketers.

A ?squeeze page? is nothing more than a way to filter out hot prospects from the mass of visitors to qualify them for the next commitment step. 

Direct marketers know this well as lead generation with various offers or requests for information to qualify the lead. 

Some people would have us believe that this is something new! Give me a break.

These new terms work great for suppliers trying to differentiate themselves as something new. Some of these suppliers would say their particular brand or ideas will revolutionize the world.

Yet underneath it all, I see nothing more than another trend.

This is not to say that the Internet has not written a new chapter in direct marketing. 

I see it, however, as an extension of capability rather than a replacement to the rich body of pertinent knowledge that already exists. New marketers need to study direct marketing principles now if they want to do great things with new media.

Successful direct marketing strategies essentially leverage a tested body of knowledge about what people respond to.

In my opinion, the environment changes continually, but people have not changed for thousands of years. What held true in 3000 BC does so in 2008. People's need for security, hope, fairness and the need to be treated as someone special always remain.

Great offers will always drive response. And so long as we understand this by testing offers and learning more about our target audiences, then we will continue to make money for our companies and clients.

Getting too wrapped up in the technology is a big part of what happened in the dot.com bust. The technologist ran the show rather than experienced marketers. (There were some additional things at play to cause this.)

But note how even today, web site designers build web sites that look good to the client and those few visitors that manage to find it without any thought about how the search engines "read" and rank sites.

(I have prospective clients who come to me AFTER the site is published before asked for SEO help. As you know, the time to deal with SEO strategies occurs before and during the web site development.)

Strong direct marketers do not fear the Internet age, they thrive on it. Our challenge has always been the wide held belief that the Internet changed people's behaviors so much that past testing and experiences bear no value.

The truth is that people created the Internet for themselves. This new medium in Nirvana for direct marketers. Interactivity and CRM can now attain it's full potential.

As knowledgeable direct marketers, we view the Internet as yet another medium that adds a "new" tool to our portfolio. It compliments traditional media rather than replacing it.

Ted</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Apryl Parcher hit upon the response to your original question when by saying:</p>
<p>&#8220;I don?t believe that &#8216;old school Direct Response&#8217; has lost touch with the new world?it?s the other way around.&#8221;</p>
<p>What impact will our ideas about how to leverage social media, twitter or even spam weary email environments do when the people who cut their teeth on new media don&#8217;t even have a command of the basics?</p>
<p>We?ve seen terms like Web2, Web 3 and will probably read about Web 285 soon. Then we also hear terms like ?squeeze pages? that traditional marketers know how to do better than inexperienced marketers.</p>
<p>A ?squeeze page? is nothing more than a way to filter out hot prospects from the mass of visitors to qualify them for the next commitment step. </p>
<p>Direct marketers know this well as lead generation with various offers or requests for information to qualify the lead. </p>
<p>Some people would have us believe that this is something new! Give me a break.</p>
<p>These new terms work great for suppliers trying to differentiate themselves as something new. Some of these suppliers would say their particular brand or ideas will revolutionize the world.</p>
<p>Yet underneath it all, I see nothing more than another trend.</p>
<p>This is not to say that the Internet has not written a new chapter in direct marketing. </p>
<p>I see it, however, as an extension of capability rather than a replacement to the rich body of pertinent knowledge that already exists. New marketers need to study direct marketing principles now if they want to do great things with new media.</p>
<p>Successful direct marketing strategies essentially leverage a tested body of knowledge about what people respond to.</p>
<p>In my opinion, the environment changes continually, but people have not changed for thousands of years. What held true in 3000 BC does so in 2008. People&#8217;s need for security, hope, fairness and the need to be treated as someone special always remain.</p>
<p>Great offers will always drive response. And so long as we understand this by testing offers and learning more about our target audiences, then we will continue to make money for our companies and clients.</p>
<p>Getting too wrapped up in the technology is a big part of what happened in the dot.com bust. The technologist ran the show rather than experienced marketers. (There were some additional things at play to cause this.)</p>
<p>But note how even today, web site designers build web sites that look good to the client and those few visitors that manage to find it without any thought about how the search engines &#8220;read&#8221; and rank sites.</p>
<p>(I have prospective clients who come to me AFTER the site is published before asked for SEO help. As you know, the time to deal with SEO strategies occurs before and during the web site development.)</p>
<p>Strong direct marketers do not fear the Internet age, they thrive on it. Our challenge has always been the wide held belief that the Internet changed people&#8217;s behaviors so much that past testing and experiences bear no value.</p>
<p>The truth is that people created the Internet for themselves. This new medium in Nirvana for direct marketers. Interactivity and CRM can now attain it&#8217;s full potential.</p>
<p>As knowledgeable direct marketers, we view the Internet as yet another medium that adds a &#8220;new&#8221; tool to our portfolio. It compliments traditional media rather than replacing it.</p>
<p>Ted</p>
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